QRZ! Ham Radio 4/QRZ Ham Radio Callsign Database - Volume 4.iso/digests/tcp/940180.txt

Internet Message Format | 1994-11-13 | 10KB

Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 04:30:10 PDT
From: Advanced Amateur Radio Networking Group <[e-mail]>
Errors-To: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Precedence: Bulk
Subject: TCP-Group Digest V94 #180
To: tcp-group-digest


TCP-Group Digest            Mon, 22 Aug 94       Volume 94 : Issue  180

Today's Topics:
                       16bit vs 32bit OS debate
                        Dos Computers (3 msgs)
                        Enough (fwd) (2 msgs)
               Thanks for connect to HamFair WWW server

Send Replies or notes for publication to: <[e-mail]>.
Subscription requests to <[e-mail]>.
Problems you can't solve otherwise to [e-mail].

Archives of past issues of the TCP-Group Digest are available
(by FTP only) from UCSD.Edu in directory "mailarchives".

We trust that readers are intelligent enough to realize that all text
herein consists of personal comments and does not represent the official
policies or positions of any party.  Your mileage may vary.  So there.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 09:56:27 -0500 (CDT)
From: [e-mail] (Steve Sampson)
Subject: 16bit vs 32bit OS debate
To: [e-mail]

Klarsen <[e-mail]> says:
>     I find it interesting that many of you on these Internet ham
> radio "echos" are very hostile to the Disk Operating System and the
> computers that can use that operating system. I think for the most part
> the guys most vocal about the evils of DOS are using computers bought for
> them to use by others, often the tax payers of the state or the country.

Interesting thesis. You're position is that if we had to pay our
own way that we would use the MS-Disk Operating System. Using
MS-DOS we would then be less likely to criticize it.  You may be
interested to learn that people have criticized MS-DOS since the
early days. Before that they criticized CP/M.

What I really hear you saying, is that you think most people on
the "echos" are using Operating Systems that are more powerful
than DOS, and that you feel threatened that your work will
become insignificant.

I would like to say that I find programming an interesting
skill, and that the platform which I target doesn't really
matter. I still find the PC an interesting box.  I've yet to
design a program that requires much more than the small model.
But I'm finding that using Windows at home is much more
productive.  I can TAB between tasks and perform more work than
straight DOS.  The fact is, that DOS is not a productivity OS.
Two programmers given a project, with one forced to use DOS, and
the other Windows (Linux, OS/2, Unix...) will not finish at the
same time. The tools offered by the multi-task OS are much more
powerful. Not only that, but the linear 32bit wide memory model
is much easier to program for. Add to that virtual memory and
you have the OS which can do anything, and is not limited to
16bit wide architecture.

To counter your fear that you will become insignificant, I might
add that anything people are discussing on these Sigs are not
directed at you personally.  If you enjoy Commidor [sic]
computers, then we have as much right to enjoy whatever box we
are using.

>    Now I own a 486-66 computer with 16 meg of ram and run windows
> and have a lot of free ham software and commercial software I purchased.
> I use Word for Windows version 2.0c because it makes this DOS computer a
> desk-top publisher. I do that while my f6fbb packet bbs is working, my
> jnos is sending an ftp out and my telephone bbs is being used.

Here you have left your own thesis and seem to be saying that
you don't use DOS either.  Now I'm confused.

>    The idea that to be good you must have a Indego is false. The
> facts are if you write ham software for a SUN station you will not be
> able to give it away. There are just not many in homes yet.

Let me offer an alternate conclusion.  The reason most hams use
DOS is that it comes free with their computer. Today, most
computers come equipped with Windows OS. I realize Windows uses
an API on top of DOS, and that it can be moved to another OS
(Solaris Wabi). The Linux project is probably the closest to
providing a replacement for DOS proper. There is some work on a
Wabi for it, and will offer a platform for all your Windows
investment. As a bonus, it comes equipped with all the things
people port to KA9Q NOS. I think that the 16bit DOS has no
future when a 32bit OS with the power of Unix is available for
free.
--
Steve

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Aug 1994 12:50:53 +1000 (EST)
From: Dave Horsfall <[e-mail]>
Subject: Dos Computers
To: TCP digest <[e-mail]>

>     Those of you that hate DOS, what kind of computer do you use at
> home? Well that is what hams have. I still have users with Commidor 64
> computers. But most now have a DOS of some size.

I have a 386SX-20 running BSD/386 1.1, largely assembled from donations
and scrap e.g. a faulty fan in a power supply was replaced.  It has 2
500Mb SCSI disks which cost me nothing - they had a few bad blocks
which rendered them useless for SunOS.  The mini-tower was written off
as scrap when a fork-lift went through the back of it - a bit of work
with a hammer and pliers fixed that.  I estimate I spent not much more
than AU$800, all told.  Why do Amateurs feel compelled to lash out on
the "latest and greatest" h/w and s/w, when something a little more
pedestrian will suffice?  What's Amateur Radio coming to?

It replaced an aging CP/M system which was my mainstay for 10 years.

I also hate DOS - it wastes good silicon.

--
Dave Horsfall (VK2KFU) | [e-mail] | VK2KFU @ VK2AAB.NSW.AUS.OC | PGP 2.6
Opinions expressed are mine. | E7 FE 97 88 E5 02 3C AE  9C 8C 54 5B 9A D4 A0 CD

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 09:26:23 +0200
From: stuart  <[e-mail]>
Subject: Dos Computers
To: [e-mail]

> From [e-mail] Sat Aug 20 18:14:30 1994
> Date: Sat, 20 Aug 1994 08:50:59 -0600 (MDT)
> From: Klarsen <[e-mail]>
> Subject: Dos Computers
> To: TCP digest <[e-mail]>
> Cc: TAPR BBS Sig <[e-mail]>
> Mime-Version: 1.0
> Content-Type> : > TEXT/PLAIN> ; > charset=US-ASCII>
> Content-Length: 2335
>
>     I find it interesting that many of you on these Internet ham
> radio "echos" are very hostile to the Disk Operating System and the
> computers that can use that operating system. I think for the most part
> the guys most vocal about the evils of DOS are using computers bought for
> them to use by others, often the tax payers of the state or the country.

lots cut out.....

Thanks Karl ! A good artical realy needed saying.

        We need to put this artical in at least once a month!
        so not to forget.

73's Rogan sm0kjd

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 10:26:56 +0200
From: stuart  <[e-mail]>
Subject: Dos Computers
To: [e-mail]

>>
> In your message of Sat, 20 Aug 1994 08:50:59 MDT, you write:
> +---------------
> |     Those of you that hate DOS, what kind of computer do you use at
> | home? Well that is what hams have. I still have users with Commidor 64
> | computers. But most now have a DOS of some size.
> +------------->8
>
> (the above in re: DOS vs. Sun/SGI/whatever)
>
> If only that were the issue... the flames start when people insist that that
> PC or etc. should be used to run NT or OS/2 or Linux, etc.
>
> ++Brandon
> --
> Brandon S. Allbery KF8NH     [44.70.4.88]          [e-mail]
> Linux development:  iBCS2, JNOS, MH
>
>
Is it not realy the same issue in away ? what I mean is how do I run
NT or OS/2 or Linux on the 286's I use...

Rogan/sm0kjd

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 14:51:45 -0500 (CDT)
From: Kurt Freiberger <[e-mail]>
Subject: Enough (fwd)
To: [e-mail] (TCP-Group Mailing List)

Just so y'all can see what happens on this perennial flamefest:

Real civilized.

Forwarded message:
> From [e-mail] Sun Aug 21 13:25:18 1994
> From: [e-mail] (Steve Sampson)
> Message-Id: <[e-mail]>
> Subject: Re: Enough
> To: [e-mail] (Kurt Freiberger)
> Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 13:20:08 -0500 (CDT)
> In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]> from "Kurt Freiberger" at Aug 21, 94 12:51:54 pm
> X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL13]
> Content-Type: text
> Content-Length: 114
>
> >
> > ENOUGH, DAMMIT!!!@!!!
> >
>
> Take a fucking pill or unsubscribe asshole.
>
> Jesus Christ, what a jerk.
>
> --
> Steve
>


--
# Kurt Freiberger, WB5BBW   Dept. of Computer Science, TAMU              #
# Internet: [e-mail]      |  "Even MY hypocrisy has its limits." #
# AuralNet: 409/847-8607          |                                      #
# AMPRNet: [e-mail] |        - "Doc" Holliday, Tombstone   #
# Disclaimer: Not EVEN an official document of Texas A&M University      #

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Aug 94 22:43:24 -0400
From: [e-mail] (D. Crompton)
Subject: Enough (fwd)
To: [e-mail] (TCP-Group Mailing List),

Might I remind you all that this group is retransmitted in many
places to AMPR. Please keep it down.

Doug

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Aug 1994 02:48:10 +0900
From: Isao SEKI <[e-mail]>
Subject: Thanks for connect to HamFair WWW server
To: [e-mail]

Hello ALL,

Hanfair'94 at Tokyo finished last day.
Thank you very much for connected to "http://pmodem01.hamfair.prug.or.jp/".
We connected 108 sites at world.
You can connect to "http"/www.prug.or.jp/" everyday.
Thanks

Isao.
---
Isao SEKI / JM1WBB (HAM Radio)
EMail: [e-mail] (NeXT Mail OK) / [e-mail]


------------------------------

End of TCP-Group Digest V94 #180
******************************